Repost of The Hill article re: Trump tapes.

Views: 98

Comment by Ron Powell on May 13, 2017 at 5:21am

 "Tapes" is an anachronism that may be descriptive of what may exist as recorded material but not very accurate.

Back in the day of "Watergate" recording devices required the recording of material on actual magnetic tape and recording devices hidden or concealed in relatve proximity to the source.

Today, digital recording devices are in use which do do result in or produce a physical or tangible reproduction of the source material. The 'tape' is not a physical or tangible property at all but data, ie bits and pixels....

This presents issues and problems both logistical and legal that didn't exist or couldn't be imagined when Nixon's Oval Office tapes were turned over to Congress, gaps and all.

Comment by JMac1949 Today on May 13, 2017 at 6:43am

R&L

Comment by koshersalaami on May 13, 2017 at 6:56am

The storage medium is tangible. The differences are that the storage medium is no longer strictly dedicated to storage and that the data are easily replicated. So, if you record onto a computer or phone, there is not a physical part that is only dedicated toward a given recording. However, the whole device is a mechanical storage medium. In terms of the ability to delete files, the same is true of erasing tapes. 

Comment by Ron Powell on May 13, 2017 at 9:23am

@Kosh; "... In terms of the ability to delete files, the same is true of erasing tapes."

There are huge technological differences between analog recordings made on magnetic tape and those developed as digital files....

Deleting material is just one minor aspect of the similarities...

The forensics involved in doctoring and detecting edits and omissions in magnetic tapes versus what can be done with digital files are worlds apart.

We might still be in the dark re the infamous "18 minute gap" in the Nixon tapes if the recording was done digitally....

"Today, digital recording devices are in use which do not result in or produce a physical or tangible reproduction of the source material. The 'tape' is not a physical or tangible property at all but data, ie bits (bytes) and pixels...."

The tangible storage vehicle or device is not the recorded material itself...

A search warrant for "tapes" can be quashed if the warrant isn't explicit re all manner of instrumentalities that may be used to record, store, transmit, transfer, edit and playback any and all of the source materials in question....

Comment by MV Neland on May 13, 2017 at 4:43pm

I think there are 2 instances of possible "tapes" or recordings. 1) Trump has suggested that he taped his dinner with Comey. He has a history of taping employees and also guests at Mar-a-lago. His reasons? From paranoia, to control, to possible leverage at a later time. 2) There are incidental collection survelliance recordings, if not destroyed. I think that Trump is very worried about a conversation or two that he had early on and is doing his best to insulate himself against whatever he may have said that would implicate himself. I think he did not know about the incidental collection surveillance going on in Trump Tower until too late. Probably a mobey pass thru/real estate deal with a Russian oligarch. Or, the hotel deal in Bahrain that violates US sanctions on the Iranian Red Guard, who were part and parcel of that deal. Trump spent nearly two weeks divesting himself from that single deal after the election.   All normal shady behavior for Trump that he let slip over the phone unthinkingly once in the running. He has always had everybody else do the work setting up and negotiating deals, but HE always closes them personally. Always. Old habits die hard. It will be his money laundering and old habits that expose him in the end.

 

Comment by koshersalaami on May 13, 2017 at 6:30pm

Regardless of the medium, storage is tangible. The difference is not in the tangibility of the storage. An IPod is an object like a CD player is - the primary difference is whether the parts move. 

As to there being a world of difference in media, which there is, the difference is not only in tape. It is possible to design tape to be recorded on digitally but, like CD's, it's moving. Digital tape and digital CD's use bytes and bits. 

As you alluded to, there have been gigantic leaps in editing technology, and that's going to make evidence a whole lot less reliable. manipulating in digital domain is way easier in all sorts of ways, and those ways leave fewer sonic artifacts. Getting the timing of changes right can be done exactly and easily. Changing content involves far fewer side effects - for example, in analog if you speed up a recording, the pitch has to rise, a la Alvin and the Chipmunks, but in digital you don't need to shift pitches. Plus the side effects are visible in editing and can often be edited themselves. In analog you get a lot of mechanical noise unless your equipment is super good and expensive, the problem being that various forms of distortion are picked up by whatever senses the signal, like skips on a record or hiss on tape. However, in digital, those forms of distortion have to be encoded to show up as signal, which is why a scratch on a CD doesn't sound like a skip.

The other problem is not tangibility of storage but non-exclusive use of the medium. A phone does a whole lot more than record, so handing it over to authorities entails giving them way more information about you than handing over a tape would, and that's one place Imthink the law gets complicated. 

Comment by MV Neland on May 13, 2017 at 6:38pm

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Under_Suspicion_(2000_film)

The great suspense movie Under Suspicion comes to mind in your examples, koshersalaami. 

Comment by MV Neland on May 13, 2017 at 6:44pm

The 2000 version with Gene Hackman, Morgan Freeman, Nydia Caro. 

Comment by Ron Powell on May 13, 2017 at 7:21pm

@Kosh;

I did not allude to, or make an indirect statement about anything.

I made a direct statement:

"The forensics involved in doctoring and detecting edits and omissions in magnetic tapes versus what can be done with digital files are worlds apart."

And, this assertion is as accurate as it gets:

"The tangible storage vehicle or device is not the recorded material itself..."

So, unless we conclude that the magnetic tape is not the actual recorded material but merely the vehicle which contains the recorded material, or upon which the recorded material is imprinted, thus making magnetic  tape sanalogous to digital discs, the distnctiion stands for purposes of accuracy re legal finding of fact or gathering of evidence in congressional or judicial proceedings....

 

Comment by koshersalaami on May 13, 2017 at 9:37pm

magnetic tape, CD's, and cellphones are all vehicles for storing recorded material. The difference is in storage method, not content. Some form of translation is necessary to get the music off the device/medium. The differences are in how they're stored and, for lack of a better concept, what language they're stored in. Digital is a little like storing data in extremely fast accurate Morse code. Tape isn't music, tape is tape. Tqpe is a medium "upon which the recorded music is printed." 

Comment

You need to be a member of Our Salon to add comments!

Join Our Salon

NEW BLOG POSTS

Where To Now?

Posted by Robert B. James on May 25, 2019 at 2:19pm 7 Comments

Thanks, Lorianne

Posted by nerd cred on May 25, 2019 at 12:13pm 2 Comments

Twenty-Three Minutes

Posted by J.P. Hart on May 25, 2019 at 3:57am 12 Comments

© 2019   Created by lorianne.   Powered by

Badges  |  Report an Issue  |  Privacy Policy  |  Terms of Service