Finally we get to "How the Russians did it." The vote total WAS effected by curbing the ability of certain voters to vote.

http://www.msnbc.com/rachel-maddow/watch/us-election-officials-stil...

It cannot be overstated that NO election audit had been performed for the 2016 election in regards to the Russian hacking until very recently.  These specific and directed investigations being conducted by The Department of Homeland Security are now revealing that the Russians did, in fact, suppress Democratic vote totals through voter suppression by hiding their crime within the expected Democratic voter suppression now common in US elections.

Views: 676

Comment by MV Neland on June 24, 2017 at 11:14am

Well...i'll admit i AM challenged to take your hostility seriously.  But, the topic is a critical one imho and nerfs ooen fuscusdion and debate as can be found here at oursalNo spell ckecker. Damn! Then again, you can't even get my name right and it's right there on the page.  I fogured it had to do woth your omline translator.  How's the weather in Macedonia? I mighta mispelled that. My apologies if i did. Again, i'm impressed with your runaway assumptions over my bloviating...er... anuther mistake - Rachrl's bloviating. I think you left out "effective" and "instrumental" towards getting the word out to the common wretch. How many Americans are you reaching to allow them information about a major assault on an already weakened democratic institution? I await your details, if you're willing to use yourself as a standard and example of commumicating peryinent and usrful information to strangers beyond chouces in hairstyles. 

Comment by MV Neland on June 24, 2017 at 12:02pm

Clarification -my above response directed at Silla.

Terry. Yep. Well summarized.

Angry buddha guy.  Yep. Which is why we need to expand our awareness of global power plays and our role in subverting stable governments for "strategic interests."  All part and parcel. And, for me right now, we have an opportunity and obligation to publicly dissect, identify, and correct past and present mistakes to reduce future ones by coming to terms with the dark practice of electoral interference and the chaos and suffering that comes from disempowering others. I'm hoping empathy might be increased in this national lesson for those nations some of our representatives felt justified in intimidating and destroying. It's a long row. Equally, many in our systems of power abhorred, and still do, such criminal meddling...to give the practice its kindest appellation.

The mentality is the same and the justifications similar - America's or Russia's - and are ultimately the source of upheaval which simply reinforce the nationalism that spawns such acts in the first place. It is THIS threat that i try to challenge when articles or stories cross my path that i can use.

Even Rachel Maddow spoke to "past US CIA interference" in one of her podcasts. So, some acknowledgement exists at MSNBC as a MSM outlet.  But, i'm certain that it will be up to ALLof us  to make sure that both Russia and the US honor voting. Perhaps it's time to support however we can Pres. Carter's human rights voter observer program.  We need such tools more than ever.

Comment by koshersalaami on June 24, 2017 at 2:38pm

The issue isn't Russia. The fact that Russia is doing this is hostile but not unusually immoral.  The issue is American complicity with Russian anti democratic actions. There is a difference between how we judge George III and Benedict Arnold. Putin is expected. A whole American political party of collaborators is not. We are looking at complicity with a foreign government that means us harm. This is pretty much the definition of treason. All that stuff that Ann Coulter says about liberals turns out to be true of her allies.  People in the White House and Congress are doing way more damage to our country than, say, Jonathan Pollard, a man who deserved prison. 

If you think I'm exaggerating, try to imagine Republican reaction if Democrats worked with the Russians to win an election.

Comment by Safe Bet's Amy on June 24, 2017 at 4:16pm

 A whole American political party of collaborators is not. We are looking at complicity with a foreign government that means us harm. This is pretty much the definition of treason. All that stuff that Ann Coulter says about liberals turns out to be true of her allies.  People in the White House and Congress are doing way more damage to our country than, say, Jonathan Pollard, a man who deserved prison. 

Speaking of Jonathan Pollard... All Jews are traitors, liars and thieves.

^^See what I did there^^???  Yup!  I used KB's big 'ol broad brush to smear a LOT of people who are not guilty of anything even vaguely like what he is accusing them of and of which they would find to be truly abhorrent.

Comment by koshersalaami on June 24, 2017 at 5:01pm

Who am I smearing who's innocent? How much of the Congressional Republican leadership do you see up in arms about American collusion with Russian interference in the election? 

And since when is political choice analogous to ethnicity? 

And given how you talk about Democrats, who are you to judge about generalizations and broad brushes?

knew if I mentioned Pollard, even though I said the guy deserved prison and didn't defend him at all, it would set you off. 

Comment by Ron Powell on June 24, 2017 at 5:09pm

Comment by Safe Bet's Amy on June 24, 2017 at 5:18pm

Way to TOTALLY miss the point, KB.  BTW, myopic much?

Comment by koshersalaami on June 24, 2017 at 5:28pm

You think I missed the accusation about generalizing? If that's not your point, learn to write.

Comment by koshersalaami on June 24, 2017 at 5:29pm

Ron,

Glad you found the Biden interview. He puts it very well. 

Comment by Safe Bet's Amy on June 24, 2017 at 7:05pm

 You think I missed the accusation about generalizing? If that's not your point, learn to write.

Duh!  When you first say:

A whole American political party of collaborators is not. We are looking at complicity with a foreign government that means us harm. This is pretty much the definition of treason. 

Which, BTW, not only accuses of being a traitor to the United States everyone who voted Republican for a multitude of reasons and/or who didn't vote for your anointed Saint Hillary, but also smeared WITH THE SAME HUGE BROAD BRUSH anyone who is waiting for any actual proof to be presented (and as I said before, Rachel Maddow "interpreting" another commentator's "interpretation" of HLS' murky testimony doesn't count).

You then follow it up with:

Who am I smearing who's innocent?

So yeah...  DUH!!!!   You missed the point that you massively over generalized AGAIN, which makes me want to say, "LEARN TO READ BEFORE YOU START CONDEMNING PEOPLE'S WRITING, DUMBASS!

...but apparently all of that was missed in your rush to scream the equivalent of "You antisemitic bitch, you!!!"  with your "I missed the point completely"-ish:

And since when is political choice analogous to ethnicity?

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